Keith Westcott - Memories of Croxley Green
Recorded 20th August 2022
Recorded 20th August 2022
Int: The first question I’d like to ask you is when did you come to Croxley? And why?
K: We came to Croxley in October 1988. It was a suitable location for both of us to commute to our jobs and we just wanted a larger property – a three bedroomed property in an attractive area.
Int: Where had you come from, that Croxley seemed so attractive to you?
K: We came from North Watford. When we first married we lived in Walthamstow and we wanted a larger, three bedroomed property and Croxley seemed to fit that well.
Int: Do you remember how much your house cost in 1988?
K: Round about £115, 000 I believe.
Int: And do you know what its value is today in 2022?
K: Well, it must be somewhere between £600,000 and three quarters of a million but it will probably be worth another £20,000 tomorrow!
Int: What was Croxley like in 1988? What were the shops like – did you shop locally? How did you sort of interact with the village when you first came here?
K: Probably not a lot, apart from going to the library, which was the old library before it was burnt down. We probably didn’t do very much shopping locally. Most likely is that we just went to Sainsbury’s or whatever and did the shopping then and perhaps picked up the odd two pints of milk – and that was literally it. I mean I remember there were butchers in Croxley, greengrocers in Croxley at that particular time, but I suppose we were a typical working couple who basically slept and ate in Croxley.
Int: Where was the library before, that you used to go to before it burnt down?
K: On its present position, but it was a smaller library and we both were rabid readers so obviously that was one focal point, so we changed basically from the library in North Watford – which we still occasionally go to – to the one in Croxley.
Int: What did you notice about the village when you first came to it? What was the makeup of the village?
K: The makeup of the village was quite different from what it is today. A lot of people had bought their properties in the fifties and sixties. They were very much people who were properly skilled in traditionally C2s, skilled working class or C1s, administrative people, jobs basically, who had scrimped and saved and lived in Croxley, which was a nice area of basically Metroland housing. Those were the people that were our neighbours basically; many of them of course have now passed away.
Int: And as that sort of group of people who were living here when you first moved to Croxley have passed away, how do you see in Croxley change?
K: Become much more diverse. It has become much more, I think, a place where professionals move to. It’s become, I think, a much more interesting and diverse community.
Int: What do you think is interesting about the change? What has – or what kind of changes have happened?
K: Well, we’ve got people whose parents and grandparents were born in other parts of the world and, as somebody who’s travelled very widely round the world, I find that extremely refreshing. Although they themselves in most – practically all cases – were born in the United Kingdom, I think it’s great to have such a pleasant diverse community, and to have people who have got really interesting stories to tell, very interesting jobs, and a pleasure to talk to.
Int: What do you think has prompted the changes?
K: Largely I think possibly house prices. Croxley’s got an incredibly good location. It’s close to the Green Belt, you can go out of Croxley and walk in the countryside very easily, you can walk along the Grand Union Canal. It’s located close to a tube station with a frequent service into central London, it is close to the M25. Most of the houses here can be changed from a three bedroom to a four bedroom house. The difference in Croxley between a three bedroom house and a four bedroom house is probably a quarter of a million pounds, and therefore people can actually come here, buy a property and grow the property, expand the property, and still be living in a very pleasant environment.
Int: Apart from the library, did you make use of any other entertainment facilities around here locally?
K: Not really at the beginning, no.
Int: You used to go into London on the tube a lot?
K: Maggie worked in London for a time, with the tube. But I worked in various schools in North London and took obviously the car. We went into London for exhibitions and the occasional theatre trip and suchlike, but no, we didn’t make much use. I’m ashamed to say that we haven’t actually ever been to the Palace Theatre in Watford, despite the fact that we’ve lived in Watford for forty odd years. I mean it is on our to-do list and when they’ve got a play that we really want to see in the next eighteen months we will obviously go there, but – we have been to both local museums, we have been to the one at Ricky and the one in Watford, so we have done that, but it’s like everything else, you don’t always take notice and appreciate your local area. Perhaps the one thing Covid did - you began to appreciate your local area.
Int: What did you appreciate about Croxley during the Covid period, the lockdowns?
K: The ease with which you could get out and walk and get into the countryside or go along the Grand Union Canal or go across Croxley Moor. The fact that we were restricted for such a long period of time and that – because the weather at the beginning was reasonably good - we could actually go out for a walk for an hour or so and do the exercise that everybody needs, basically.
Int: Did you discover any parts of Croxley during those walks that you really hadn’t known about despite having lived here since 1988?
K: Yes, I think the parts over to the north of the village. I’m trying to think of the name of the woods that are out at the back.
Ints: Towards Merlin’s Wood, and Dell Wood.
K: Yes, Dell Wood, Dell Wood is one I was thinking of, and the Woodland Trust area which is at the back there. I mean we hadn’t been there.
Int: Up round the golf course
K: Round the back of the golf course and such like. Those are paths that – we’d been along the Grand Union Canal because before lockdown, just after Maggie retired, we’d actually walked the Grand Union Canal from London up to near Daventry – in stages, I may say, you know. But having done most of it using public transport.
Int: And have you ever sort of participated in some of the Croxley events like the Revels and things like that?
K: Not really, no. No. We’ve been there but I mean in terms of participation, no.
Int: So in terms of how Croxley’s changed for you, so I know you say there’s a lot more diversity, a lot more – more interesting socio-economic changes, but can you sort of quantify or describe a lot more of those changes – when did it happen, in the nineties and the two thousands?
K: The two thousands and two thousand and tens. I should have said actually we’re both members of Croxley U3A and I’ve been a member of Croxley U3A for some time, twelve years now, so some events, in that particular case we’ve participated, you know, going to the Church Hall for some of the monthly meetings etcetera.
Int: Can we just go back – what is the Croxley U3A?
K: University of the Third Age. (Gives the history of the U3A movement and how it is often intended for those without a university education – which K and M have had, first of their family to do so).
Int: So I’ve never heard of the Croxley U3A before. Can you tell me a bit more about it? Where does it meet? How does it work?
K: (gives more general history of the movement and how you set a group up) In the case of Croxley it’s the Hall at St Oswald’s – the Church Hall – they meet up every month. And then there are groups who meet up on a regular basis, walks, London walks, ramblers’ groups, and each individual member can -
M: There are about 30 or 40 groups.
K: 30 or 40 groups, and you just go to whichever ones you feel like.
Int: Were you involved in setting the Croxley up?
K: No.
Int: So how long – do you know how long it’s been going for?
K: I don’t know. I imagine it was formed about three or four years before I joined round about 2010.
?: So about 2006, then?
K: I would imagine so. I think they’ve been around for about 30 years. (More history of the movement, and how it is good in the context of the problem of loneliness among elderly people).
Int: Let’s go back to the changes you’ve seen in Croxley over the years. You said you probably saw the real sort of socio-economic changes in the beginning of the 2000s?
K: Probably the beginning of the 2000s, or actually the late nineties. I would have said noticeable when houses became available, because that generation that had previously bought a house in the fifties and sixties were passing away and other people were moving into Croxley. And you know, we’ve got this massive problem of a housing shortage in Britain and Croxley has the great advantage of having a tube station up the road, you know, a few hundred metres from where we live and it gives people the great – particularly up until recently – of commuting into central London:
Int: Do you think the fact that there’s quite – really quite outstanding schools in Croxley – has that drawn in some of that socio-economic change?
K: Oh yes. The schools round here are – Hertfordshire’s always had a good reputation. I suppose I would say because it was one of the first authorities to really enhance comprehensive education it has actually got very good schools within its boundaries, and this area particularly is extremely well blessed with schools.
Int: And so you’ve noticed a lot of change in diversity – have there been other changes that you’ve noticed in the kind of attitudes that people seem to have in Croxley in the shops that are available in Croxley?
K: Yes, particularly you get some more interesting coffee shops. We haven’t actually used them much ourselves. I think time will tell how much Croxley’s diversity – which of course is happening throughout the whole country, it’s not just an aspect of Croxley - but I think we will see what happens in the next ten, fifteen years.
Int: Now that you’re older and maybe retired, do you find yourself using the shops in Croxley more?
K: A little more, yes. Yes. Particularly the local two Co-ops. Where they are useful, you know, increase of stuff, and I do get a daily paper every day, so that gives me a little walk up to one of the local paper shops. Yes I think we have done and I obviously will use local facilities a little more.
Int: Have you ever belonged to any of the churches in the village or anything like that?
K: You’re getting a very negative response from me because I’m basically a humanist and my views on religion are unprintable. (laughter)
Int: It’s just Croxley has so many churches when you think about such a small village.
K: Well, is it a small village? It’s one of the largest villages in the country! It’s a got a population of 13,14 thousand. So, you know, yes – we’ll get off the subject of religion! (laughter).
Int: There’s a lot of lovely green spaces in Croxley and I know that you’re aware that we have a housing shortage, maybe we need to look to the future – would you be prepared to see some of the green spaces in Croxley lost?
K: Depends what you define by green space. After all, what is it, 18 per cent of the Green Belt is actually brownfield land, so that could be utilised. I mean the Killingdown Farm – I have no problems with that, because it is not particularly an area I would say of outstanding beauty. But of course if they start talking about Dell Wood etcetera, that is a totally – we do need those green spaces. It’s got to be done sensibly, we do need extra housing and somehow we’ve got to be able to find it. We can’t be nimby, we cannot put ourselves into a situation whereby ‘stop the world I want to get off’ basis. But perhaps that would put me into conflict with a few people in Croxley.
Int: I think there are very diverse views and we have heard some. We have heard views about the tower block that’s being built by Morrison’s. Would you be prepared to see such high density housing in Croxley?
K: I don’t think Croxley needs high density. I mean the tower block – if they’d kept it to about 14 storeys it might have been more sensible. But there again, you see, Watford has had a far better - partly because it’s got more brownfield sites on old industrial premises. You know it’s done far more to help the housing situation. It has had the opportunity to do it more than say Croxley has been able to do it. Yes, it’s a bit of an eyesore down there, the Lambeth – I mean it’s been described as Lambeth in Watford, but you know, you’ve still got to answer the question – where do we house people? And we’ve got to get enough housing because the kids today can’t afford to get onto the housing market that my generation of the baby boomers who were born in the late forties didn’t have – well, you worked hard for it, but we were able to do it.
Int: Do you think the local amenities, I mean if we have lots more people here, with no new doctors’ surgeries and all the rest of – how do you feel about that?
K: There is the problem. Croxley needs a large medical centre. I mean I’m a great believer in large primary care structures. We took primary care to the third developing world and what you want is a large centre with 10, 15, 20 doctors that can deal with the local facilities. Now with a bit of thought and planning we could perhaps find somewhere in Croxley where we could have a large medical centre which could deal with small injuries, light injuries, could perhaps deal with certain things which you go down to Watford General for. I mean there is no reason why we can’t concentrate on primary care because if we concentrate on primary care you can stop perhaps the bigger diseases coming in the future. It does need that. I’m not saying you increase the population of Croxley by double or whatever but you still need to think about – yes, its schools are reasonably good and that is good now, but then again we’ve got to think about how we move around Croxley. We’ve got to think about our transport needs. We’ve got to concentrate more on, you know, where we walk, cycle, utilise public transport rather than take the car up the shops just to get your paper or whatever. I’ve got fairly strong views on the use of public transport for somebody who’s travelled round the world in public transport.
Int: I mean Croxley’s a bit funny in that we don’t have that many primary roads. You have the Watford Road which takes you through to Ricky and to – and then you’ve got the one that goes through to the back, to Sarratt. And Baldwins Lane. And that creates a lot of congestion if we bring a lot more houses in. How do you think we would cope with that?
K: I mean I agree that connectivity in Croxley is very poor, but the connectivity in a lot of places in Britain is very poor, because our road system is very poor. The Croxley Link, for example, could have solved quite a few problems among the many people who live and work in Amersham and Chesham who actually come and shop in Watford etcetera. So that you can go straight in. We could go straight in to central Watford, and we often walk into central Watford and get the bus back. I mean we have got a car, we do drive, but you’ve got to improve public transport. You’ve got to make sure people can get around fairly easily and you’ve got to think ‘well what kind of public transport are we going to have in the future?’ We’re going to have little cars, electric cars that we just hire for an hour or two hours. You know, we’ve got to be thinking what’s it going to be like in 2040 or 2050 when I’m not around. It is going to be very different from what it is now. I mean the changes in my lifetime have been phenomenal, not least of all that you walk around with a little thing which basically has all the information you can possibly have, and it’s called a smartphone.
Int: What do you think the Local Authorities like the Croxley Parish Council, the Three Rivers Council could be doing to forward plan for the kind of future you think Croxley needs?
K: Well, I also think a lot of it is needed for central government to start investing in public transport. For example the Croxley Rail Link. I mean that’s just something which in any part of Europe would have been built by now and there wouldn’t be a problem. I do think we’ve got to think in terms of more cycle ways. I think children have got to walk to school and not basically come by car. I mean we have an infants school just – what – 200 metres, 150 metres down the road. I mean I personally think that no child in an infants school should come by car, they should walk. After all they’re not supposed to go to an infants school less than about two kilometres away, I believe. I do really think that for their health, for their own personal development, that kids need to have much more exercise and need to walk to school.
Int: Have you noticed big changes in the way that children – that you see children or don’t around about in the village since 1988?
K: Not so much as 1988, but I think the people who went back to looking at the 1950s and 1960s when I would have played outside most of the time. I think that’s the real change. I mean that new play area up by the Green, that’s excellent for the kids. And that is actually quite full most of the time. We passed it the other day and were quite surprised for once ‘oh, there’s hardly any people here!’ But that’s unusual. But I think parents have a fear, you know, that there is a problem round every corner and I think that social media has a lot to answer for in exacerbating this particular fear. I think if we all had the responsibility to look out for what was happening in the area, and took responsibility, children would be relatively safe.
Int: Maybe that is one of the main changes that people used to do that more than they do now. They’ve become more inward looking.
K: I think that’s the case, but also of course you’ve got to remember if you go back to the 50s and 60s a lot of women didn’t work.
Int: No, quite.
K: I mean I was brought up on a council estate in the 50s where the vast majority of women didn’t work, but we kids just played – alright, there wasn’t the traffic around, I’ll accept that, but we kids played on the local common, we walked across the common to primary school. Now I could just see a couple of hundred kids walking across the common to a local primary school could perhaps raise a few eyebrows today!
Int: What has kept you living in Croxley all these years? Have you never wanted to move to anywhere else, and why not?
K: Well, connectivity to start off with. We have got a tube station up the road, we’ve got buses into Watford, we’ve got the M25, we are within easy access of Heathrow, we are in easy access, relatively easy access of Luton Airport and of St. Pancras International. (M: the library) And of course we’ve got a good local library and Hertfordshire Libraries are pretty good in the sense that you can get books – you’ve only got to look on the catalogue and if you want a book you go and collect it, and you read it. I mean you make use of what’s around.
Int: But the library services have changed a lot in the last decade. I mean the library doesn’t open every day any more like it used to. Has that impacted your use of the library?
K: I would say it never did open every day, in terms of our local library. But the central ones did, the Watfords and the Hemel Hempsteads and the St Albans did, and they still do. Maybe not open one afternoon a week. Some of the libraries that are really small ones obviously. It hasn’t impacted on me. I happen to know the library’s closed on Thursday so I wouldn’t dream of going up there on Thursday. And Croxley’s actually got open access, so those of us who have got open access can actually walk into the library on Thursday morning – if we wanted to (laughs).
Int: Oh, I don’t know how that works – do you just – do you have a keycode or something?
K: You have your pin code etcetera etcetera. There are I think one or two
M: You’re giving away state secrets here!
K: But there is open access at the local library. It’s one they’ve tried and experimented in the county.
Int: So other than the fact that you – there’s this lovely mix of being able to go all over the place outside of Croxley, what’s in Croxley that’s kept you here? Int: Do you feel safe here?
K: I feel as safe as I would – but my perception of safety would be – where I’ve been in the world (laughs) – if you’ve travelled around communist Eastern Europe when you were a student and you’ve, shall we say, got interviewed by the Romanian Securitate, perhaps your concept of safety is a little different than people who’ve only been to the Mediterranean for their holidays. I mean safety is something that you perceive. We walk in parts of London which perhaps, probably people think – I go in the day of course – on walks and think perhaps ‘what are you doing down there?’ But I think it’s just a matter of common sense. There are a few American cities I certainly wouldn’t go wandering around! But it is safe, I mean the crime rate in this country on the whole is pretty low. Just a matter you might be unfortunate to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. But there’s not much you can do about that. I mean you can walk across the road and be knocked down.
Int: Have you found Croxley a friendly village to live in or has that changed? Do you think people know their neighbours less now than they used to?
K: I think they know them more. I think Covid had the advantage of people knowing each other a little better. I think when you go for a walk round Croxley and you meet people with their dogs etcetera you inevitably say ‘hello’. We never walked round Croxley thirty years ago – not to that extent, so perhaps we didn’t know. I mean the advantage of being retired is that you do tend to walk out more often.
Int: Any other views of Croxley for the future, for now, for changes?
K: Well, no, I think I’ve made things pretty clear even if I perhaps am prepared to put out views occasionally which some people might find a little challenging?
Int: That’s OK. Everybody in Croxley’s allowed to think the way they like!
K: Exactly! The one thing I might – I’ve always believed in the concept that you might totally disagree with somebody of what they did but they do have the right to say it.
Int: Have you found Croxley to be a village where you are allowed to say what you think?
K: Nobody would stop me not saying what I (Laughs). I mean I’m the child of the sixties. I went up to start my degree in 1968 and was a revolting student, and in those days it was Apartheid and Vietnam!
Int: Any last thought about Croxley before we end this?
K: Oh, it’s an absolutely gorgeous, lovely place to live in. And we’re not planning to go anywhere.
K: We came to Croxley in October 1988. It was a suitable location for both of us to commute to our jobs and we just wanted a larger property – a three bedroomed property in an attractive area.
Int: Where had you come from, that Croxley seemed so attractive to you?
K: We came from North Watford. When we first married we lived in Walthamstow and we wanted a larger, three bedroomed property and Croxley seemed to fit that well.
Int: Do you remember how much your house cost in 1988?
K: Round about £115, 000 I believe.
Int: And do you know what its value is today in 2022?
K: Well, it must be somewhere between £600,000 and three quarters of a million but it will probably be worth another £20,000 tomorrow!
Int: What was Croxley like in 1988? What were the shops like – did you shop locally? How did you sort of interact with the village when you first came here?
K: Probably not a lot, apart from going to the library, which was the old library before it was burnt down. We probably didn’t do very much shopping locally. Most likely is that we just went to Sainsbury’s or whatever and did the shopping then and perhaps picked up the odd two pints of milk – and that was literally it. I mean I remember there were butchers in Croxley, greengrocers in Croxley at that particular time, but I suppose we were a typical working couple who basically slept and ate in Croxley.
Int: Where was the library before, that you used to go to before it burnt down?
K: On its present position, but it was a smaller library and we both were rabid readers so obviously that was one focal point, so we changed basically from the library in North Watford – which we still occasionally go to – to the one in Croxley.
Int: What did you notice about the village when you first came to it? What was the makeup of the village?
K: The makeup of the village was quite different from what it is today. A lot of people had bought their properties in the fifties and sixties. They were very much people who were properly skilled in traditionally C2s, skilled working class or C1s, administrative people, jobs basically, who had scrimped and saved and lived in Croxley, which was a nice area of basically Metroland housing. Those were the people that were our neighbours basically; many of them of course have now passed away.
Int: And as that sort of group of people who were living here when you first moved to Croxley have passed away, how do you see in Croxley change?
K: Become much more diverse. It has become much more, I think, a place where professionals move to. It’s become, I think, a much more interesting and diverse community.
Int: What do you think is interesting about the change? What has – or what kind of changes have happened?
K: Well, we’ve got people whose parents and grandparents were born in other parts of the world and, as somebody who’s travelled very widely round the world, I find that extremely refreshing. Although they themselves in most – practically all cases – were born in the United Kingdom, I think it’s great to have such a pleasant diverse community, and to have people who have got really interesting stories to tell, very interesting jobs, and a pleasure to talk to.
Int: What do you think has prompted the changes?
K: Largely I think possibly house prices. Croxley’s got an incredibly good location. It’s close to the Green Belt, you can go out of Croxley and walk in the countryside very easily, you can walk along the Grand Union Canal. It’s located close to a tube station with a frequent service into central London, it is close to the M25. Most of the houses here can be changed from a three bedroom to a four bedroom house. The difference in Croxley between a three bedroom house and a four bedroom house is probably a quarter of a million pounds, and therefore people can actually come here, buy a property and grow the property, expand the property, and still be living in a very pleasant environment.
Int: Apart from the library, did you make use of any other entertainment facilities around here locally?
K: Not really at the beginning, no.
Int: You used to go into London on the tube a lot?
K: Maggie worked in London for a time, with the tube. But I worked in various schools in North London and took obviously the car. We went into London for exhibitions and the occasional theatre trip and suchlike, but no, we didn’t make much use. I’m ashamed to say that we haven’t actually ever been to the Palace Theatre in Watford, despite the fact that we’ve lived in Watford for forty odd years. I mean it is on our to-do list and when they’ve got a play that we really want to see in the next eighteen months we will obviously go there, but – we have been to both local museums, we have been to the one at Ricky and the one in Watford, so we have done that, but it’s like everything else, you don’t always take notice and appreciate your local area. Perhaps the one thing Covid did - you began to appreciate your local area.
Int: What did you appreciate about Croxley during the Covid period, the lockdowns?
K: The ease with which you could get out and walk and get into the countryside or go along the Grand Union Canal or go across Croxley Moor. The fact that we were restricted for such a long period of time and that – because the weather at the beginning was reasonably good - we could actually go out for a walk for an hour or so and do the exercise that everybody needs, basically.
Int: Did you discover any parts of Croxley during those walks that you really hadn’t known about despite having lived here since 1988?
K: Yes, I think the parts over to the north of the village. I’m trying to think of the name of the woods that are out at the back.
Ints: Towards Merlin’s Wood, and Dell Wood.
K: Yes, Dell Wood, Dell Wood is one I was thinking of, and the Woodland Trust area which is at the back there. I mean we hadn’t been there.
Int: Up round the golf course
K: Round the back of the golf course and such like. Those are paths that – we’d been along the Grand Union Canal because before lockdown, just after Maggie retired, we’d actually walked the Grand Union Canal from London up to near Daventry – in stages, I may say, you know. But having done most of it using public transport.
Int: And have you ever sort of participated in some of the Croxley events like the Revels and things like that?
K: Not really, no. No. We’ve been there but I mean in terms of participation, no.
Int: So in terms of how Croxley’s changed for you, so I know you say there’s a lot more diversity, a lot more – more interesting socio-economic changes, but can you sort of quantify or describe a lot more of those changes – when did it happen, in the nineties and the two thousands?
K: The two thousands and two thousand and tens. I should have said actually we’re both members of Croxley U3A and I’ve been a member of Croxley U3A for some time, twelve years now, so some events, in that particular case we’ve participated, you know, going to the Church Hall for some of the monthly meetings etcetera.
Int: Can we just go back – what is the Croxley U3A?
K: University of the Third Age. (Gives the history of the U3A movement and how it is often intended for those without a university education – which K and M have had, first of their family to do so).
Int: So I’ve never heard of the Croxley U3A before. Can you tell me a bit more about it? Where does it meet? How does it work?
K: (gives more general history of the movement and how you set a group up) In the case of Croxley it’s the Hall at St Oswald’s – the Church Hall – they meet up every month. And then there are groups who meet up on a regular basis, walks, London walks, ramblers’ groups, and each individual member can -
M: There are about 30 or 40 groups.
K: 30 or 40 groups, and you just go to whichever ones you feel like.
Int: Were you involved in setting the Croxley up?
K: No.
Int: So how long – do you know how long it’s been going for?
K: I don’t know. I imagine it was formed about three or four years before I joined round about 2010.
?: So about 2006, then?
K: I would imagine so. I think they’ve been around for about 30 years. (More history of the movement, and how it is good in the context of the problem of loneliness among elderly people).
Int: Let’s go back to the changes you’ve seen in Croxley over the years. You said you probably saw the real sort of socio-economic changes in the beginning of the 2000s?
K: Probably the beginning of the 2000s, or actually the late nineties. I would have said noticeable when houses became available, because that generation that had previously bought a house in the fifties and sixties were passing away and other people were moving into Croxley. And you know, we’ve got this massive problem of a housing shortage in Britain and Croxley has the great advantage of having a tube station up the road, you know, a few hundred metres from where we live and it gives people the great – particularly up until recently – of commuting into central London:
Int: Do you think the fact that there’s quite – really quite outstanding schools in Croxley – has that drawn in some of that socio-economic change?
K: Oh yes. The schools round here are – Hertfordshire’s always had a good reputation. I suppose I would say because it was one of the first authorities to really enhance comprehensive education it has actually got very good schools within its boundaries, and this area particularly is extremely well blessed with schools.
Int: And so you’ve noticed a lot of change in diversity – have there been other changes that you’ve noticed in the kind of attitudes that people seem to have in Croxley in the shops that are available in Croxley?
K: Yes, particularly you get some more interesting coffee shops. We haven’t actually used them much ourselves. I think time will tell how much Croxley’s diversity – which of course is happening throughout the whole country, it’s not just an aspect of Croxley - but I think we will see what happens in the next ten, fifteen years.
Int: Now that you’re older and maybe retired, do you find yourself using the shops in Croxley more?
K: A little more, yes. Yes. Particularly the local two Co-ops. Where they are useful, you know, increase of stuff, and I do get a daily paper every day, so that gives me a little walk up to one of the local paper shops. Yes I think we have done and I obviously will use local facilities a little more.
Int: Have you ever belonged to any of the churches in the village or anything like that?
K: You’re getting a very negative response from me because I’m basically a humanist and my views on religion are unprintable. (laughter)
Int: It’s just Croxley has so many churches when you think about such a small village.
K: Well, is it a small village? It’s one of the largest villages in the country! It’s a got a population of 13,14 thousand. So, you know, yes – we’ll get off the subject of religion! (laughter).
Int: There’s a lot of lovely green spaces in Croxley and I know that you’re aware that we have a housing shortage, maybe we need to look to the future – would you be prepared to see some of the green spaces in Croxley lost?
K: Depends what you define by green space. After all, what is it, 18 per cent of the Green Belt is actually brownfield land, so that could be utilised. I mean the Killingdown Farm – I have no problems with that, because it is not particularly an area I would say of outstanding beauty. But of course if they start talking about Dell Wood etcetera, that is a totally – we do need those green spaces. It’s got to be done sensibly, we do need extra housing and somehow we’ve got to be able to find it. We can’t be nimby, we cannot put ourselves into a situation whereby ‘stop the world I want to get off’ basis. But perhaps that would put me into conflict with a few people in Croxley.
Int: I think there are very diverse views and we have heard some. We have heard views about the tower block that’s being built by Morrison’s. Would you be prepared to see such high density housing in Croxley?
K: I don’t think Croxley needs high density. I mean the tower block – if they’d kept it to about 14 storeys it might have been more sensible. But there again, you see, Watford has had a far better - partly because it’s got more brownfield sites on old industrial premises. You know it’s done far more to help the housing situation. It has had the opportunity to do it more than say Croxley has been able to do it. Yes, it’s a bit of an eyesore down there, the Lambeth – I mean it’s been described as Lambeth in Watford, but you know, you’ve still got to answer the question – where do we house people? And we’ve got to get enough housing because the kids today can’t afford to get onto the housing market that my generation of the baby boomers who were born in the late forties didn’t have – well, you worked hard for it, but we were able to do it.
Int: Do you think the local amenities, I mean if we have lots more people here, with no new doctors’ surgeries and all the rest of – how do you feel about that?
K: There is the problem. Croxley needs a large medical centre. I mean I’m a great believer in large primary care structures. We took primary care to the third developing world and what you want is a large centre with 10, 15, 20 doctors that can deal with the local facilities. Now with a bit of thought and planning we could perhaps find somewhere in Croxley where we could have a large medical centre which could deal with small injuries, light injuries, could perhaps deal with certain things which you go down to Watford General for. I mean there is no reason why we can’t concentrate on primary care because if we concentrate on primary care you can stop perhaps the bigger diseases coming in the future. It does need that. I’m not saying you increase the population of Croxley by double or whatever but you still need to think about – yes, its schools are reasonably good and that is good now, but then again we’ve got to think about how we move around Croxley. We’ve got to think about our transport needs. We’ve got to concentrate more on, you know, where we walk, cycle, utilise public transport rather than take the car up the shops just to get your paper or whatever. I’ve got fairly strong views on the use of public transport for somebody who’s travelled round the world in public transport.
Int: I mean Croxley’s a bit funny in that we don’t have that many primary roads. You have the Watford Road which takes you through to Ricky and to – and then you’ve got the one that goes through to the back, to Sarratt. And Baldwins Lane. And that creates a lot of congestion if we bring a lot more houses in. How do you think we would cope with that?
K: I mean I agree that connectivity in Croxley is very poor, but the connectivity in a lot of places in Britain is very poor, because our road system is very poor. The Croxley Link, for example, could have solved quite a few problems among the many people who live and work in Amersham and Chesham who actually come and shop in Watford etcetera. So that you can go straight in. We could go straight in to central Watford, and we often walk into central Watford and get the bus back. I mean we have got a car, we do drive, but you’ve got to improve public transport. You’ve got to make sure people can get around fairly easily and you’ve got to think ‘well what kind of public transport are we going to have in the future?’ We’re going to have little cars, electric cars that we just hire for an hour or two hours. You know, we’ve got to be thinking what’s it going to be like in 2040 or 2050 when I’m not around. It is going to be very different from what it is now. I mean the changes in my lifetime have been phenomenal, not least of all that you walk around with a little thing which basically has all the information you can possibly have, and it’s called a smartphone.
Int: What do you think the Local Authorities like the Croxley Parish Council, the Three Rivers Council could be doing to forward plan for the kind of future you think Croxley needs?
K: Well, I also think a lot of it is needed for central government to start investing in public transport. For example the Croxley Rail Link. I mean that’s just something which in any part of Europe would have been built by now and there wouldn’t be a problem. I do think we’ve got to think in terms of more cycle ways. I think children have got to walk to school and not basically come by car. I mean we have an infants school just – what – 200 metres, 150 metres down the road. I mean I personally think that no child in an infants school should come by car, they should walk. After all they’re not supposed to go to an infants school less than about two kilometres away, I believe. I do really think that for their health, for their own personal development, that kids need to have much more exercise and need to walk to school.
Int: Have you noticed big changes in the way that children – that you see children or don’t around about in the village since 1988?
K: Not so much as 1988, but I think the people who went back to looking at the 1950s and 1960s when I would have played outside most of the time. I think that’s the real change. I mean that new play area up by the Green, that’s excellent for the kids. And that is actually quite full most of the time. We passed it the other day and were quite surprised for once ‘oh, there’s hardly any people here!’ But that’s unusual. But I think parents have a fear, you know, that there is a problem round every corner and I think that social media has a lot to answer for in exacerbating this particular fear. I think if we all had the responsibility to look out for what was happening in the area, and took responsibility, children would be relatively safe.
Int: Maybe that is one of the main changes that people used to do that more than they do now. They’ve become more inward looking.
K: I think that’s the case, but also of course you’ve got to remember if you go back to the 50s and 60s a lot of women didn’t work.
Int: No, quite.
K: I mean I was brought up on a council estate in the 50s where the vast majority of women didn’t work, but we kids just played – alright, there wasn’t the traffic around, I’ll accept that, but we kids played on the local common, we walked across the common to primary school. Now I could just see a couple of hundred kids walking across the common to a local primary school could perhaps raise a few eyebrows today!
Int: What has kept you living in Croxley all these years? Have you never wanted to move to anywhere else, and why not?
K: Well, connectivity to start off with. We have got a tube station up the road, we’ve got buses into Watford, we’ve got the M25, we are within easy access of Heathrow, we are in easy access, relatively easy access of Luton Airport and of St. Pancras International. (M: the library) And of course we’ve got a good local library and Hertfordshire Libraries are pretty good in the sense that you can get books – you’ve only got to look on the catalogue and if you want a book you go and collect it, and you read it. I mean you make use of what’s around.
Int: But the library services have changed a lot in the last decade. I mean the library doesn’t open every day any more like it used to. Has that impacted your use of the library?
K: I would say it never did open every day, in terms of our local library. But the central ones did, the Watfords and the Hemel Hempsteads and the St Albans did, and they still do. Maybe not open one afternoon a week. Some of the libraries that are really small ones obviously. It hasn’t impacted on me. I happen to know the library’s closed on Thursday so I wouldn’t dream of going up there on Thursday. And Croxley’s actually got open access, so those of us who have got open access can actually walk into the library on Thursday morning – if we wanted to (laughs).
Int: Oh, I don’t know how that works – do you just – do you have a keycode or something?
K: You have your pin code etcetera etcetera. There are I think one or two
M: You’re giving away state secrets here!
K: But there is open access at the local library. It’s one they’ve tried and experimented in the county.
Int: So other than the fact that you – there’s this lovely mix of being able to go all over the place outside of Croxley, what’s in Croxley that’s kept you here? Int: Do you feel safe here?
K: I feel as safe as I would – but my perception of safety would be – where I’ve been in the world (laughs) – if you’ve travelled around communist Eastern Europe when you were a student and you’ve, shall we say, got interviewed by the Romanian Securitate, perhaps your concept of safety is a little different than people who’ve only been to the Mediterranean for their holidays. I mean safety is something that you perceive. We walk in parts of London which perhaps, probably people think – I go in the day of course – on walks and think perhaps ‘what are you doing down there?’ But I think it’s just a matter of common sense. There are a few American cities I certainly wouldn’t go wandering around! But it is safe, I mean the crime rate in this country on the whole is pretty low. Just a matter you might be unfortunate to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. But there’s not much you can do about that. I mean you can walk across the road and be knocked down.
Int: Have you found Croxley a friendly village to live in or has that changed? Do you think people know their neighbours less now than they used to?
K: I think they know them more. I think Covid had the advantage of people knowing each other a little better. I think when you go for a walk round Croxley and you meet people with their dogs etcetera you inevitably say ‘hello’. We never walked round Croxley thirty years ago – not to that extent, so perhaps we didn’t know. I mean the advantage of being retired is that you do tend to walk out more often.
Int: Any other views of Croxley for the future, for now, for changes?
K: Well, no, I think I’ve made things pretty clear even if I perhaps am prepared to put out views occasionally which some people might find a little challenging?
Int: That’s OK. Everybody in Croxley’s allowed to think the way they like!
K: Exactly! The one thing I might – I’ve always believed in the concept that you might totally disagree with somebody of what they did but they do have the right to say it.
Int: Have you found Croxley to be a village where you are allowed to say what you think?
K: Nobody would stop me not saying what I (Laughs). I mean I’m the child of the sixties. I went up to start my degree in 1968 and was a revolting student, and in those days it was Apartheid and Vietnam!
Int: Any last thought about Croxley before we end this?
K: Oh, it’s an absolutely gorgeous, lovely place to live in. And we’re not planning to go anywhere.
